The Goal of Complete Freedom

[macorules94]

28RedEyedCrows from GTAForums:

I love GTA IV, and I loved all of them at one point or the other. (I've been with them since GTA One for the PC) Nearly every time; what kills a GTA for me is the graphics, not the gameplay. I normally only stop playing them when other games surpass them in the graphics department (sometimes even Rockstar's own games such as 'The Warriors') cause going back to them, they look funky and become hard to play for those that aren't hardcore.

As much as I played the hell out of them - especially San Andreas or even GTA2 - I always used to make fun of the way people died/fell down, how things blew up, the cartoony visuals, etc. ever since Vice City. Regarding the 3D versions, it has almost always been behind the times graphically (except III), and for some reason, (possibly because of the size) has never been up to par visually with any of Rockstar's other big time games, which doesn't make a lot of sense. I got 'Bully' and 'The Warriors' and went back later to play 'San Andreas' and was frustrated that it couldn't even compete graphically with those two games, so I forgot about it and kept playing 'Bully'. The fighting systems and animations alone in those two games were so superior. Wasn't the first 'Manhunt' out before SA? I only stopped playing that game just before 'Manhunt 2' came out. I still love the way that game is, though it's finally pretty dated now.

Despite me bashing GTA graphically, I still played them for months and months for one reason: "The freedom to do anything in a large, virtual world." Of course, this concept has not come true just yet, but the groundwork has been a lot of fun so far. They've tried hard to give us a lot of stuff to do, and make it bigger and more interactive every time.

But now, suddenly, GTA IV comes out with great graphics and THE best reaction system (Euphoria is it?) I've personally ever seen. The way people react and fall... I can't get enough of the shoot outs, and the world, lighting, etc. are beautiful. I also know that they put a LOT of effort into the story and acting and commend them for it. I don't fault them for anything that is there.

Of course, I know why people are frustrated; Now the graphics are great, the animations are great, the story is great and what happened? There's less free stuff to do, and even though the graphics alone make the game as replayable to many (myself included) as SA, the end-of-game replayability suffers once again and it's getting old. (I'm talking about Single Player)

There's nothing wrong with they DID add. The relationships, the mini-games, all of those are brilliant; but Rockstar has a bad habit of creating these awesome worlds, only to forget to add in missions/events that can be randomly generated and infinitely played once the story is done. The groundwork is always there, and it nearly always falls short. Many times it wouldn't even be difficult to do. With 'The Warriors' there were no more gangs to fight, and you end up being civilian beating thugs. With 'Bully' there were no more cliques or jerks to fight, and you end up being a bully yourself. The same ideas are what hurt GTA. The assassination missions could have been infinite, gangs could be more prominent and go to war with each other (or you), no taxi missions (except in the beginning), no more riots, rampages, ambulance missions....(sigh). The only thing that is action oriented I CAN do in 'GTA IV', now that I've completed it, is shoot civilians and cops at random (seeing a trend here?), except for the vigilante missions which had SO much potential. Have you ever gone after a gang and called the police? They get in awesome shootouts and is one of the coolest things I've ever seen in a game. You can even hide behind one of the cops' cars with them while they are shooting at each other, but guess what? You try and help the police by shooting your own gun and you've got a 2-3 star wanted level. Let us JOIN the police for crying out loud. Some of us want to be good guys. 555-RECRUIT should have worked, seriously... I love the freedom, but Rockstar tends to limit gamers to being a$$holes once the stories are done (action wise), unless you like walking. You can't even be smart a$$holes.

Part of that 100 million went to recreating a city that works, for the most part, as an interactive postcard (not counting the people/vehicles). It's gorgeous and fun as hell to drive/run through it, but once you've seen it, you've seen it. You can't even sit down on benches or smash windows, and you can't be awed forever. I would have been happy in an area just the size of ONE of the islands if I could actually enter the buildings and shops were functional, and I've been hoping for that ever since III came out. I'm still waiting. I was so disappointed when I got to Las Venturas in SA, saw all of those beautiful Casinos only to discover that only TWO were enterable.

I, and others, can get a bad rap from other fans for being hard on Rockstar. But you know why we are? We love this game/series and we want to see it reach it's full potential. We know Rockstar "rocks". GTA IV made 500 million! It's not like people are sending flaming bags of poo to Rockstar. (Bully Reference)

With that said: This, finally, needs to become a true crime simulator, even if it takes longer to release the next game. That 'freedom' tag needs to reign true. The graphics engine is finally awesome, so let's go for it! We need to be able to break into buildings, put graffiti on walls, blow up more than just cars, deal drugs, rob stores, take hostages, start gangs, start gang wars, prison breaks, have stand offs with negotions, etc. etc. And for the good guys, we should have a complete area for wannabe cops, adding in apprehension, transporting, detective work, intimidating interrogations, and generally working WITH the police for once which I always wanted to do. Hell, Niko is basically a good guy. I doubt he really gets a kick out of mowing down cops and civilians. He apologizes every time! Once people have TRUE freedom to interact with a COMPLETE world, complaints will fall to the floor.

I would honestly suggest that in the next GTA, there's no story. I LOVED the story in IV, and Niko is now one of my favorite characters ever, but seriously, going back to GTA's roots might not be a bad idea in order to get the replayability right once and for all, and Rockstar could save face by allowing players to play as cops or criminals. On the criminal end, let's just have a game like the first one, where you create a criminal and just toss that dude (or gal) into a fully functioning city where all of those things I mentioned above are available. Want to jack a car? Do it. Want to drive that car into the front window of a shop in order to steal some goods? Do it. Want to sell those goods to a pawn shop to get money for selling drugs? Do it. Oh, and why not take your jacked up car to the chop shop on the way and have a shootout with the guys when they try and screw you over. Make sure you spray paint your own custom logo on their walls once your rampage has ended, though that might piss off the local gang who will come after you. Doesn't that sound fun, AND replayable? In the eyes of the original creators, to me, that's exactly what GTA should be. Setting up a reactionary system where one thing effects another on it's own, you could make one hell of a game that would NEVER be exactly the same.

So there is my rant. GTA is like my kid (if I had one) I love it, I pay for it, but it can also disappoint me and piss me off. If anyone is reading this... ...I'd like any thoughts you have. Trust me, if I could say all this to the Rockstar developers, I would. I wish/hope they'd listen to all of you.

Edited December 21, 2008 by macorules94

[TheGunslinger]

Getting a wee bit of plagiarism in this morning are we? Ehem

[WRX22B1998]

WOW. lol.

errr yeah wtf...

[Earthbound]

Much credit to the actual author. Pretty awesome, and many good points made.

[macorules94]

well and i credited the actual author for this:

http://www.thegtaplace.com/forums/index.ph...&pid=326704

and no one payed attention so i thought screw it

[Dazza]

Graphics don't make a game.

I love playing VC more the IV.

[Scott.]

VC will always be the best GTA game. I have to say though, IV does come in a close second.

[Dazza]

I must agree, it goes VC, VCS and then IV.

Freedom though is something that GTA will never get, it's more of a Spore, or Sims 3.

[Ultraussie]

I know in Vice City theres a cop outfit, and Im always playing pretend-cop with only a Nightstick and Pistol, but I hate it when I "arrest" a fleeing "criminal" ped that the real cops give you a few stars (Leave me alone!!!!!), and when your doing Viligent (I refuse not to do it without the cop suit), espcialy with the Rhino the cops give you 4 stars after a few seconds.

There should be missions where you have to be a cop, and if you want to keep being a cop there should be a "quickplay" mode where you arrest (Handcuff) criminals and take them back to the Station.

It would be awesome if GTA was a first person shooter.

But now, I must give heaps to the actual original author!!

I also must show what GTA would look like as a FPS